Creativity in Motion: Supernatural Choreographer Dave Kassirer EP|33

Meet Supernatural Choreographer Dave Kassirer!! Dude's passion for creativity and movement shines through as he shares his love for music, art, and the Supernatural Community!

Visit the website at: https://fortheloveofthemap.buzzsprout.com

Join the For the Love of the Map’s Facebook Community: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1153000382332695/

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Check out Dave’s other creative projects:
https://on.soundcloud.com/kL4qs

https://on.soundcloud.com/5iH6W

https://vimeo.com/148957029

https://vimeo.com/170560963

Transcript

Music, Creativity, and Passion

Dave 0:00

What does meditation do ? It tells you where to go , it tells you what to do you know , or it lets you be you . So I like puns and kind of dad joke puns things that are probably not that funny , but it's kind of like aha .

MJ 0:14

You know some tool , some tool . Can we get some tool please ?

Dave 0:17

Oh man , I mean me and Justin are already dejected position of like the hard and soft moments in that song . A dejected position of the hard and soft moments in that song , super connected to that song , that location . I'm going to turn it and say what Would you Think I Did ? Oh gosh , obviously it was my subtitle 99.9% . Sure that that was the first high box I did and half of that song is windfall . It is . I made beats in groups and sometimes put some beats to those and half of that's on a dribble . It is , it's a group and sometimes there's some beats to it .

MJ 0:48

Make sure you check Dave's journey , make sure he played this workout with us since he suggested it , you know . Yes , welcome back to another episode of For the Love of the Map , where we talk all things supernatural , choreography and the joy in movement . Today I'm super excited to introduce you guys to Mr Dave . That's what I call him . I actually call him Mr Rave , but we'll get into that later .

Dave 1:24

Oh no .

MJ 1:25

Welcome to the show , Dave .

Dave 1:27

It's a pleasure to be here with you . I don't know why I did that voice , but yeah , I'm just super excited .

MJ 1:35

And I don't think I mentioned this , but this is one of the eight Supernatural , eight supernatural choreographers . So we get to get a peek behind the scenes at dave , his process , who he is , all the things super excited , um . But first I I had an idea to start this off and we're gonna go super fast with this . This is first gut reaction . No time to think style questions you ready ?

Dave 2:05

Yeah , I think so .

MJ 2:06

Dave's like what . What are we doing ? Okay , what ? Broccoli or carrots Broccoli your face .

Dave 2:18

You're like neither there's a lesser of two evils . I , I don't know why .

MJ 2:24

Yeah , cool , all right winter or summer winter .

Dave 2:29

I get really hot in the summer fair desert or beach ironically desert over beach .

MJ 2:44

Interesting Okay .

Dave 2:46

I've never actually been to the official desert , but it's very beautiful .

MJ 2:52

It is very beautiful .

Dave 2:53

And you travel a lot .

MJ 2:55

Yeah .

Dave 2:56

I see it from a plane .

MJ 2:57

Yeah , I was going to say maybe you see it from the plane . You read my mind , dude , or maybe I read yours , true , all right .

Dave 3:08

Flow or boxing .

MJ 3:09

Boxing .

Dave 3:11

That cheating .

MJ 3:12

No , I'll take it .

Dave 3:13

Okay , cool .

MJ 3:15

All right . Super important one the balance of our friendship is on this one .

Dave 3:29

Rap or country ? I'm ashamed that you even asked me that question , because it's definitely rap , 100% . I think you knew that , though .

MJ 3:36

I did , I did , I did .

Dave 3:39

Some you know there's some outliers , but yeah , definitely rap .

MJ 3:44

Always outliers and everything , but definitely rap . You're my kind of person . All right , very last rapid fire question Sock shoe , sock shoe or sock sock , shoe , shoe .

Dave 4:00

Can you repeat that ?

MJ 4:01

Yep , and look at your feet while I'm doing it , Like pretend you're like putting on your socks and shoes getting ready for the day . Sock shoe , sock shoe or sock , sock , shoe , shoe 100% , no questions asked .

Dave 4:18

Sock , sock , shoe , shoe .

MJ 4:21

Okay , all right , fine , you're the opposite of me , that's cool .

Dave 4:24

It's because I always have socks on Like I don't like to take them off , so that's another story . But yeah , Uh , sock , sock shoe , shoe , shoe fly .

MJ 4:43

Um ,

Broken Toe

MJ 4:45

tell me the story about your broken toe .

Dave 4:49

About my broken toe . I mean , I actually don't really know the story . It just kind of happened and I just thought it was swollen for no reason . But I went to Europe with my wife in the spring . It was a long overdue vacation and we walked like 40 miles in eight days in four different countries .

Dave 5:19

And then I got back and found out that it was broken . It might have been potentially . I joke with Justin about this , about how one of the last things I did before my vacation was play through Thrill and Fury . That pros only , so I joke about that being the reason why my toe is broken . But who knows , that could be it so , but there's really not . I probably just stubbed it , honestly , probably , and it's mostly better now .

MJ 5:54

so Is it mostly better .

Dave 5:57

Yeah , yeah , yeah yeah .

MJ 5:59

So I see a ton of different music equipment . Behind you I see a keyboard of different music equipment behind you . I see a keyboard , a guitar , what I see ? A drum back there . Yeah , I'm there Some things Assume . Music is one of your passions .

Dave 6:20

Yeah , and you know , I I don't always consider myself a musician . I consider myself like a maker of noise . I do like to make music but I'm not like classically trained and I wouldn't say that I'm super great at one particular thing , I just kind of like everything . So while I play bass and sometimes I play regular guitar I'm not very good at that , I'm better at bass I also produce music and you know , just in general like to make beats in groups and sometimes put some beats to it . So yeah , and that started a really long time ago . I think I was in a punk band , like when I was 13 , and played music in bands probably through the end of high school , and then I started DJing and producing and stuff .

MJ 7:24

So yeah , it's been a while oh wow , you said DJing and producing . I don't know if I've ever told you this , but my partner , chris , is also a DJ slash producer , or was it's one of his hobbies ? He used to to play at events and shows , um , but now he says he's too old for all that , but often plays in the spare bedroom and one of the things he has a keyboard , and he's really big into keying music and making sure things are mixed in the proper key . And so I remember when we first started dating it would be awesome beats in the night here started dating , it would be awesome beats in the night here , just like over and over for hours while he was keying his tracks .

Dave 8:15

So , Yep , Yep , Um that I guess I can kind of tell a parallel story with like uh . When I first moved in with my wife like ben girlfriend , before engagement , you know um she was like kind of uh blown away by the amount of wires I had , um , just like I was moving my stuff and it was just like multiple boxes full of all different cables and wires . I'm like no , I need all of these . So that's part of being like kind of a musician or being into computers and you know electronic music . Otherwise it's just , you probably have an obnoxious amount of wires .

MJ 9:04

Yes , cords , we have them . I'm really lucky that Chris is super . I say OCD about it , but he has very great kibble management and has them very organized and put away in places and like labeled . But we have a ton like why do we need all these ? But he says we do , so I leave that alone , go ahead . There's have a ton why do we need all these ? But he says we do so . I leave that alone , go ahead .

Dave 9:27

There's always an occasion .

MJ 9:29

So you have a lot of experience in music bands producing what ? Else did you do ? What did you go to college for ? I assume you went to college .

Dave 9:44

Well , I've always done .

MJ 9:47

So I should assume .

Dave 9:49

No , don't , don't , it's fine , I mean .

Dave 9:51

I could lie right now but I'm not going to . So I I actually started in the creative zone , I guess , with like graphic and web design creative zone . I guess it was like graphic and web design , um , I was doing that in towards the end of high school like um , like a vocational school , while I was in high school , um . So I was doing . The program was called advertising , arts and design , so we were doing , you know , print and digital media , um , a little bit of like html for websites and stuff like that , and definitely that's what I wanted to do . But because I'm always like , meh , shiny new thing , shiny new thing , I think that has morphed over time where I did about a year and a half of the whole graphic design thing at a community college by me and then I took , I think , a semester or two off and then I came back and did audio and video production , because I guess that's just the progression of things and that's what I actually got my degree in .

Dave 11:03

So , yeah , audio and video production , I really wanted to . I wanted to make a living like actually making music or scoring films or just doing things that I uh admired other people doing like , even like , doing like , uh , like foley . You know what a foley artist is . Yes , yeah , like I would love like that . That was always something that I was like oh , I love to like cut up vegetables and make sounds with them , you know like that . Um , so , yeah , I , I think , while my interests have changed , it's all part of the same .

MJ 11:42

You uh zone , I guess for sure definitely all creativity based um 100 maybe . Maybe I mean I guess computer , it was computer graphics and design . So that is creativity um I guess code is often considered creative . Maybe too um that's my brain coding yeah , I did some basic stuff back in the day with like myspace no , everybody .

Dave 12:18

I mean , that was honestly like myspace and uh , do you ?

MJ 12:23

remember .

Dave 12:24

AngelFire websites , yeah , so that's where my interest peaked . I think I made a Blink-182 fan page when I was 11 or 12 . I was doing that . Angelfire and GeoCities , I think , were the two . And yeah , myspace definitely is a creative outlet , even like aol instant messenger . You got to create your own little like buddy icons and stuff . So I think that's where the graphic design stuff um really originated . Um , and I would do flyers for events and um . You know , I actually worked at a print shop for about a year and a half , um , doing like signage and stuff for like retail stores and um , that was a interesting , it was like an apprenticeship and then a job and then yeah , so that was , uh , the start of my creative endeavors , I guess what other types of creative projects have you worked on ?

Dave 13:29

Um , I mean , it really runs the gambit , I think , like I like to make things . Uh , you know whether it's creative or it's a puzzle you know , it's like . I , I like to use my hands . You know um and build things and hands , you know and build things and you know , over the past few years I've been getting into more . I mean , I've always liked to paint . I'm not really good at drawing , but I think probably in 2020 , I started getting into different mediums like resin epoxy , using concrete a little bit of wood .

Dave 14:11

I'd like to get more into woodworking , though , but just to make household objects , even jewelry , mostly for gifting to friends and family or just to have around the house . Uh , but you know , that would be a nice little fun side project to have like a little shop where I can sell my stuff , cause like yeah , um , I like making things , you know .

MJ 14:40

I relate to that . I like making things too , and if I could I would have like a little workshop with all the things woodworking , glass blowing , I mean , you name it . I just want to play and dabble and mess around .

Dave 14:55

I actually um this lamp back here . Yeah , um , that was actually my first space amp that I've gutted and I've just put a light bulb inside of it . That's cool . So , yeah , I like to repurpose , you know , everyday objects too . Like we have one of those big old school TVs that's like wooden and on wheels from like the 70s , like the 70s , and , uh , I'm trying to convert it into like a , like a display case with like lights and stuff . It's been like a multi-year project because you know I procrastinate . So , yeah , I think it's fun repurposing things so they have a new life yeah , I like that too .

MJ 15:41

I I definitely enjoy that . Maybe I don't do that personally often enough , but I appreciate others who do , and the thought of making things and gifting them to friends and family . That speaks to my heart . If you make me something , I'm keeping it forever . You write me a note , I'm keeping it forever . You don't need to buy , I'm keeping it forever . Like you don't need to buy me something . Make something . Um , everything my kid has ever like art projects or anything she's made . It has been very difficult for me to throw any of it away . I have a special box I keep things in .

MJ 16:17

Um , so I really I can really relate to that and the creativity behind it . It's , it's got soul in it . You know emotions .

Dave 16:26

It feels good , it feels great for sure . It's just tangible things , Like I can reach out and touch it , Like they're . You know not going to touch everything in my office that I've made , but , um , you know it just feels like great , Like I mean it , it was fun when I was doing graphic design , just for fun or for work or whatever , but making something that I can feel and touch and hold , that has space , uh , there's just something different about that .

MJ 16:59

So agreed , man . So take me back to the end of 2020 , beginning of 2021 . That's a crazy time in everyone's life Beginnings of . Covid just about to start . We're all locked away locked away , yep

Community and Virtual Reality Fitness

MJ 17:24

.

Dave 17:24

So if we were talking about the end of 2020 , that would mean my you know career , my experience as a supernatural athlete , had been in full effect for a few months at that point , because I actually , weirdly enough , bought a quest um and picked it up . The original quest , you know , one zero , whatever , um , I picked it up , I think if it wasn't the exact day it was the week that supernatural launched and I got a targeted ad and I wanted to check it out and it's like the rest is history . So if we're talking about later that year , I was already like super obsessed and just really into VR . Like in my mind , in the back of my head , I was like I really , really would love to work in VR , it doesn't matter what it is Like at some point in my life this is .

Dave 18:23

I was like I really , really would love to work in VR . It doesn't matter what it is like at some point in my life , this is where I want to be . So that's kind of like what I was thinking at the end of 2020 , towards the beginning of 2021 . I had a job and I was working from home already , obviously , even before COVID . I was remote and so I wasn't like actively looking for employment , but I knew in the back of my head that that's where I wanted to be . I didn't know Supernatural , but just in VR , because it's such an emerging field that you know , we have no idea where it's going to be in a few years , but it's already changed so much since , you know , the first time I wore a VR headset .

MJ 19:15

So yes , for sure , and I know that you were a supernatural athlete right before you became a choreographer . You did the workouts . I mean , you were one of us . You still are one of us , You're in the community . But the fact that I can go back and I'm definitely going to add this to the YouTube version of this episode but I found a fantastic post of you and you're doing flex Friday before it's really officially for flex Friday and it's a gift of you and you're in your arm and you're tagged Leanne about a workout and I just thought he's one of us .

MJ 19:56

He's one of us . I think that's .

Dave 19:59

Yeah , I think both Kat and I um were .

Dave 20:03

I might be wrong , but I think probably the two of us were the only ones I think were in the community first before joining the team , at least on the choreo team .

Dave 20:14

But yeah , I mean I feel like the first month or two I was so blown away but I don't think I was like an everyday kind of blown away like I mean it blew my mind but I needed to work up to it because prior to that I did not like moving my body aside from , like you know , dancing and whatever I didn't working out never really like clicked with me .

Dave 20:41

Obviously , everybody can relate , um , a lot of people can relate , but I think , like I would say , when I actually joined the community , that's probably when I became like a four or five days a week , sometimes seven days a week , kind of supernatural athlete , because prior to that it was like you know , I'll hop in for a few things here and there , um , uh , but then , yeah , I think it was like a couple months later , so like june or july , I think of 2020 is when I joined the community . There's like a thousand people in there and uh , yeah , it was uh , a very , very uh welcoming place and , you know , still is uh just for 189 000 more people , something like that . I don't know what to know .

MJ 21:31

Maybe not that much better there's a lot of people there now , for sure , and I think it's really cool that you brought up . You were just sort of a casual supernatural user athlete , but then as soon as you joined the community , you became full blown five , seven days a week . It's something about the community . It's the whole package of everything of supernatural offers , but the community is such a major part of it . As soon as you get plugged in there , it's just it . Everything takes over . You learn about new workouts , you meet other people , you relate to others .

Dave 22:07

Um , it's such a driving force of keeping people motivated and getting in the headset yeah , and it's like you know , it's something that , uh , in most cases , like going to the gym doesn't have . Like you , I guess , if you talk to people at the gym when you work out , that's like a sense of community or whatever , um , working out of class and they see the same people over and over again . But I think the melding of community and this immersive workout , you know , that's very unique and I think I have always kind of needed gamification for things to really click for me Um , probably cause my attention span and a bunch of other things . But , yeah , I think that , uh , everything came together and here I am .

MJ 23:04

And here I am . That's amazing . And you mentioned Kat because I know both of you were athletes

Training and Background

MJ 23:10

. First Did you come across Benny's posting in the community , the same way Kat did , looking for level mappers .

Dave 23:19

Unicorns .

MJ 23:20

Yeah , unicorns , unicorns , definitely unicorns . Is that how it worked for you ? I did .

Dave 23:39

Yep , I did , I saw it and at that point I was employed and I saw it and I think I got the job and then , you know , not that much later , my company that I worked for prior essentially dissolved . My , you know , my team . We were a small team that worked remotely , doing boring stuff , but yeah , that was kind of like a sign because almost immediately after that I saw that there was another listing for choreographer . Um , and in between the time of the first and the second posting , I actually like took a um br app development course , um , you know , uh , so I learned a little bit , uh , how to code and how to use unity and building worlds and I just became more like involved in you know , vr , uh , and I was like this is where I need to be , um , um .

Dave 24:46

So yeah , I did see it , I did see that posting Um , and it definitely spoke to me .

MJ 24:53

So tell us about I . I know for Kat . She got called down , went there , they kind of went over how to map and we're like here , let's see what you got . Is that how the process sort of worked for you ?

Dave 25:11

Um , you're saying that that she physically went to the um she did , but she's in California and and I know , Right , yeah , so yours was probably remote . I I'm in New York , so , um yeah , remote , Um , there were . It was probably a similar process , though , because I believe I was taken . You know , I applied and was interviewed and got to meet a lot of awesome people and I was like I really want this job . I didn't say that , but want this job um , I didn't say that , but um , uh .

Dave 25:47

I think initially a few of us were hired on like a uh , almost like a probation , probationary kind of basis , like uh , I don't know if it was supposed to be like 60 or 90 days or something . But you know , um , it was basically like let's see what you can do .

Dave 26:05

But you know , it was basically like let's see what you can do , and you know , after , I mean after I got the position , I was so ecstatic , but there was a part of me that was definitely nervous , like , oh , I have this thing and I might you know it's possible that I might lose it . But then the other part of me was like no , I got it . So , um , I , yeah , it was definitely a um , a long training experience , um , and unlike things that I've done in the past , but there are definitely some parallels and uh , yeah , I think that it was a long but amazing stretch to get to where I am now .

MJ 26:51

Right and I could be wrong here , so correct me if you need to . Unlike some of the other choreographers , you don't come from a professional dance background . You like to dance , you enjoy the movement you do , but you don't have any dance training . You come from more of a musical background .

Dave 27:15

That is correct , totally correct . I don't have formal choreography experience , don't have formal like choreography experience , but I always like to say that movement is kind of my ethos . I'm always like in a constant state of motion and I think that , going back , you know I used to . I did karate for a few years , I did soccer for a few years . I mean , I kind of always felt like I needed to do something else , just because that's my brain , but I also got really obsessed with DDR for a little while . Dance , dance Revolution .

Dave 27:57

I had a pad in my basement and I'm not sure if it was that exactly , but I , ironically , was nicknamed Dance Dance Davey for a while . That name kind of stuck . That was my first screen name on Instant Messenger , I'm pretty sure . And yeah , the Dance Dance part was partially because of VR and then I was around the time I think that Fall Out Boy song came out too , which I was really into Fall Out Boy back then . So it was kind of a push and pull and a both double meaning . But yeah , so my inspiration I think is more from my passion for music and the way I interpret sound and the way I see sound and the way I see it . You know , and I also grew up like my mom was an aerobics instructor and I used to like help her set up for classes and then , you know , play the boombox and , like you know , um , you know , basically like um usually put out some mats stuff like that Um at like a local , you know school , you know gymnasium or whatever .

Dave 29:14

Uh and so , and my grandma also worked out all the time Like so I grew up around fitness , fitness , adjacent Um and I , you know , have gone to plenty of events music festivals , concerts , whatever where I really like to get down , um . So , yeah , I've always loved to move , but I never . I didn't have that like formal dance training , yeah .

MJ 29:42

Right , just a free spirit . Didn't have that like formal dance training .

Dave 29:47

Yeah right , just a free spirit , of spirit , about it getting in there like that , yeah , exactly like , uh , you know , like to get a little loose , remember um , so you get the job .

MJ 29:58

It's supernatural , man . What a dream you get to do it remotely . You get to stay in new york and work in your headset . What did you think of the editor ? Were you like ? Oh my gosh , what do I do here ? Experimenting with a lot of other ?

Dave 30:09

dr apps and you know , I think , that the way it works is , you know , akin to , uh , like a dr version of , like photoshop or something . So I'm very familiar with those kind of you know , editing softwares and I think that being able to understand how those pieces come together I think really helped during the training process . Obviously , it's the body movement is where , yeah , it wasn't really learning editor itself . That was the challenge . It was like learning to , you know , trust my body and you know , from watching and playing all the other maps , I feel like I tried to I don't want to say reach , that's a bad word learn and grow from watching all of the other amazing choreographers on this team . And you know , we've also done a lot of in-person events where we focused on body movement and , you know , done some boxing classes and stuff like that .

MJ 31:35

So , yeah , I think that I don't remember what the beginning of my rant was , but we were talking about the editor and how it sounds like it was way more intuitive to you in the beginning because , yes , of your graphic design background , because of the vr training building classes you took and things like that , so it sort , of um , that part wasn't difficult .

Dave 32:04

It was the figuring out the movements and and getting a map made exactly , and also like from using um dawes digital audio workstations . Like you know , ableton live is the one that I use most of the time , but there's plenty of others out there like Logic and Pro Tools that I've also used . I think using those , there's a way that you look at sound and waveforms , that you know the soft and the loud and the low and the high end of the sonic , you know spectrum of music , Um , and I think that , uh , that's really I think um what influences me the most is really like uh , yeah , the , the music obviously dictates , and then I just let it guide me .

Dave 33:10

Um , that's probably . Yeah , I think it makes sense to me .

MJ 33:15

Yeah , that makes sense to me too . You listen to , to the music and figure out how you want to put the movement in the space in the map . Make it for us , do you ? I know that you love so many different genres of music . Do you have a favorite you like to map to .

Dave 33:38

It's like I think it's on a case-by-case basis , because I sometimes find a lot of things surprising , um , but I think that the like the indestructible series is obviously one that was kind of relaunched like uh , I want to say recently , but it was literally like a while ago now it was a long ago now but it was literally like a while ago now .

Dave 34:07

It was a while ago now . It was skinny jeans and rip scenes originally was where we would put our , um , you know , kind of indie flavored stuff , um , and that's like I feel like home base , you know , for me , because that that's , you know what I really into , my elements . But , um , because of my you know , love for electronic music too I like you know the drop , you know differently , just dance stuff like that .

Dave 34:35

Now I'm talking about serious but specific music genres . It's like so much harder to , um , yeah , to identify , yeah , just because I I hate saying it , but I do like almost everything .

Dave 34:49

So , uh , I would say I , I don't know I can't really say there's anything in particular that I don't love mapping um , aside from maybe things I haven't tried before , like I'm not a musicals person , so I have not delved into that because I feel like , we have a lot of other people on the team who love musicals and you know , I would rather let them do it , not just because I don't think I can , it's more like you know , I , I would rather let them do it , not just because , like , I don't think I can , it's more , like you know , nine times out of 10 , you're , if you're passionate about something , it's going to , it's going to come through , you know .

MJ 35:36

Yes , definitely . So let the people who are passionate about that have it . Yeah , definitely , that makes a lot of sense to me . You mentioned just dance , because we were talking about electronic music , all that . Maybe you can help me figure out this mystery . Have you ever noticed that every single Just Dance workout card has a fish on it ? Every single one . Why ? Why is it a fish ?

Dave 36:07

Dave , I , I have like noticed that casually , but I never really thought about it .

Movement, Music, Meditation, and Inspiration

Dave 36:15

Um , these are the .

MJ 36:16

I would assume .

Dave 36:17

this is what I would assume and I could be wrong , so don't quote me on this , even though now , um , I'm just going to make this up right now . But it could be right that the nature of a fish and the way that a fish moves in water is akin to dancing . It's like flowy and free , and you think about , like I don like finding nemo , like just keep swimming , like I don't know . It's kind of like , uh , that's really that's the thing that would .

Dave 36:50

that would jump out at me um , but there could be something that's more , uh , deliberate that I just don't know . Um , but yeah , now that I'm thinking about it , I've definitely done a few and , um , they have all had fish .

MJ 37:05

So every single one of them have fish and it's got to be that it has to be there . It has to be that I think , so I mean yeah , nothing else makes sense I mean I don't like .

Dave 37:21

We have plenty of workouts with you know , animal cards basically , but usually Glutaceous , all the glutaceous , have animals . A specific part of animals , usually Behind . You know Exactly , but yeah , I think that . I think it's because it's supposed to promote that kind of like free flowing Fancy fleet , like kind of I'm a fish , I'm just flapping my little fins . Yeah , they don't flap them Right . Because , those are wings .

MJ 37:56

Yes , those are wings Cause they're in the water .

Dave 37:58

Just glide .

MJ 37:59

Yeah , that's a good way to put it . Okay , so no specific genre of music is your favorite to map . It's more of like the vibe and the feeling . Is what I'm getting from you .

Dave 38:12

Yeah yeah .

Dave 38:14

I like when things have a theme , you know , and like a through line , tell a story , tell a story . And you know I think I had the most uh , fun and kind of like very uh , you know enriching experience when working on the drop , the bass meditation , the sunrise base meditation , because you know I was passionate about the music . You know I had a hand helping to curate the playlist and just conceptualize , kind of that workout . You know , obviously , I know you guys talked about the original base meditation that came out , I think in 2021 , somewhere early , like around the time I started , but this was kind of , you know , influenced by that , obviously , and I think that , yeah , that it told the story , you know , from start to finish , both with your body and with your mind , and that's what I like to do .

Dave 39:24

I mean , not everything is going to be like that . Some things are just going to be . Let's just have some fun , you know . But even if there's a story to be told , sometimes in like the song titles , like I will on occasion request things are , you know , moved you know they don't have to listen to me , but like if I feel are , you know , moved ? You know they don't have to listen to me but like if if I feel like you know the song titles tell a story in a different order , I might be like let's just move that around .

MJ 39:56

I like that idea . So you brought up one of my all time favorites categories , the drop base meditation . That first workout that came out , but I was waiting for so long for more of them . So when the first week that um supernatural went to , monday drops versus daily drops we were gifted with the drop , two of them , a high and a medium , and you are responsible for the medium . The coolest thing about this medium . First of all , the breathwork triangles . Can we talk about those ? Were those your idea ? Yeah .

Dave 40:37

Yeah , and I'm glad that you brought that up , because I you know there's a lot of great feedback that we've gotten about that workout , um , but there hasn't been that much , uh , about the breathwork triangles . And for me , um , it's not like a novel concept . But you know , over the past couple of years I have been focusing on my mind and body a lot more and meditation is something that you know is I used to kind of like pan as being , like you know , hippy dippy or something , and but now I've learned to accept it and it's become a daily thing , literally every day . I do a nighttime meditation , but sometimes I do during the day as well , and I do a lot of just breath work . So I wanted a way to try to incorporate that in Supernatural without , you know , trying to reinvent the wheel , so to speak .

Dave 41:41

And you know , um , and you know , uh , doc has a lot of really great meditations , yes , um , and you know he also actually has one on box breathing , which it was kind of like the inspiration for the breathwork triangles . Essentially , there's no wrong way to do it , but you just let the triangles and the sound of the triangles and the tone in the music just kind of dictate when to inhale , exhale , hold , you know , rinse , repeat , and I think that in the beginning of that workout kind of sets you up for success and it actually comes back , I think just for a little bit in the second half of the song and I feel like it's a great time to just like recenter and then , you know , blow your way through the rest .

MJ 42:42

Yes , most definitely . And the breathing being reminded to breathe is something the coaches tell us to do all the time . Right , and it's so important when you're working out , when you're exercising , and I feel like it really sets the tone for that workout . In a way , it opens you up , you're getting really in touch with the way your body feels , how the oxygen coming in feels , and it just sets you in a good spot for the beginning of this workout to give it your all . It is a medium . However , if you go into it with full intensity , full force , feel the music , it is like a high for me and that's because I just love that workout so much . There's also some new , different tales in that workout that I find very interesting .

Dave 43:40

Yeah , so I think that's something that I had pocketed from , I think , an accident at one point and it's something that I knew that was capable we were capable of doing with our tools that we have . But it was kind of like you know , they're the same tails that we use for turns , you know . So they're typically , you know I think somebody else has mentioned it but sometimes you call them flag turns . You turn to the side , the double horizontal strikes the only time that you'll see them , um , you can call them turntails , chevron tails . I think there was people calling them vibration tails because they make their controllers vibrate more . Um , you know anything , uh .

Dave 44:31

But there's just something about kind of like , uh , trying to add something new aside from just the breathwork stuff throughout the workout , um , that kind of connected both the sunrise and sunset , uh , together , and I think that , even though it's not a huge difference , I think it just lends itself to you know , the flowiness and the direction , because literally , they're a bunch of arrows , and what do arrows do ? They tell you where to go . And it's like you know what does meditation do ? It tells you where to go , it tells you what to do , you know , um , or it lets you be you . So I think , like having more , I guess arrows um does make it feel a little more meditative you know ?

MJ 45:24

Yeah , I agree , I love that workout , man . The day that it came out I was so excited . I freaked out because it had been years and did not disappoint . Dude , such a fantastic workout . It's in my bookmarks , I save it , I play it when I need to just get in touch with myself and sort of let go and get outside of my own head , because it allows for that . It gives you the space . The movement encourages it , leanne encourages it . It's just , oh , chef's kiss .

Dave 45:57

Great , great work . Leanne was really really , really like home run with the coaching on that one , and our curators are really amazing and it was just a pleasure working on that and you know I , you know we'll see what happens in the future .

MJ 46:17

Yeah , we'll see . I'm hoping that the base meditations are something that we see more of . I made sure to write , to write supernatural , and tell them that please , please , more of those .

Dave 46:32

Yes , definitely I would . I would love that as well . There's so much , you know . There's a lot of stuff there too that's not just fully electronic music that still has similar elements , you know . But yeah , I think it's like that was just yeah , still my it's like my life's favorite workout too , I think .

MJ 46:57

Is it she loves it .

Dave 46:59

One of . Yeah , she plays that one a lot and then she plays the full body . Chills like that somewhat older power workout .

MJ 47:10

It's a fantastic workout .

VR Fitness

MJ 47:12

Do you have songs in that workout ?

Dave 47:14

I don't .

MJ 47:14

I think that came out somewhere in my earlier days if I'm not mistaken so maybe it was in 2022 , but earlier or something like that , it was early . I know that politic . The Coldplay song is a Lowry song yes confess to that um . I absolutely love that workout so that's why I was like Dave do you have songs in that workout ?

Dave 47:43

I don't know about , and full circle that's why I was like Dave , do you have songs in that workout I don't know about ? And full circle . That's why you know when I found out that he even the fact that Chelsea , who is the curator on that one , the environments were intentionally chose into the cool down on the first one goes into the warmup on the second . So it's just a story . You know Um and yeah , I um that was , yeah , it was super fun .

MJ 48:35

So I recommend , if anyone's looking for a killer , killer workout , to play the original medium that came out a few years ago . I'll pop it up on the screen . If you're watching YouTube , then Dave's medium , then all back to back to back , and if you don't leave that workout feeling at peace but also energized and just , it's just . Oh , it's an experience , it is a story , for sure .

Dave 49:09

You can't see it on the screen right now , but I still get , you know , like goosebumps , like . All the time I get that frisson I think it's called frisson Essentially that feeling , you know the , the chills and the goosebumps like I get . That that's triggered a lot by sound , smell , touch . You know a lot of different things , but even just talking about the thing that gives me the chills will give me the chills sometimes . So it's like cool .

Dave 49:43

You know it did it's . I guess it's dopamine , but um not exactly sure the science behind that , but has something to do with dopamine yes , most definitely .

MJ 49:56

And speaking of dopamine , I have to bring up another workout . It's another medium flow workout of yours and it's an artist series and it's Florence the Machine . I just played it yesterday . I love that workout . I love that workout . I will say I make my own sort of quick hit-ish with it . I play the first four songs and I leave . Dog Days are over because I play that in another workout all the time . So when I'm looking for .

MJ 50:33

I want to play as many of my favorite workouts as possible . I'll cut one song out of something , cause I know I'll play it in this workout over here . You know , um , yeah , dude , cosmic love .

Dave 50:47

Yeah , that's cosmic love and you've got the love . Are the two that I did and that worked out , and I'm pretty sure that Lowry did the other two , I'm not mistaken .

MJ 50:57

So it's kind of similar . It does make sense .

Dave 51:00

Yeah , I , yeah , that was one of my favorite maps , for sure . Cosmic love because the juxtaposition of like the hard and soft moments in that song it's just like kind of like almost like hit you know , like interval training almost , because there are just these flowy moments and then there's these drumming moments and there's like , yeah , so it's uh , uh , she's . Florence is an amazing singer and the band is amazing and this , yeah , I loved that .

MJ 51:36

Were you a fan of Florence before ?

Dave 51:38

um , you took on this workout or those songs , yeah , Um yeah , I uh actually got the opportunity to catch her at a festival a couple of years . A couple years , I have no perception of time same um either .

Dave 51:54

uh , I'm pretty sure I went to montreal a couple times for a festival and , uh , you know they were one of the headliners and , um , even not being like super close , you could feel like her energy and the band's just energy from so far away . And yeah , um , yeah , so I , I , yeah , I love a lot of music . Um , I wouldn't say I'm like the biggest fan ever . I probably don't know all every single song I've ever put out , but the ones that I do know I know very well . Um , and yeah , that that one just spoke to me , yeah , yeah , well , I'm .

MJ 52:38

I'm glad because you can feel that it spoke to you . You could . You could tell you were a fan of the song just based on the mapping alone , but to me that map stands up to the test of time . Every time I get in I find something new , some new way of moving in there . That's just different than the time before . You know what I mean . I really enjoy that set . Yeah , I think that that was probably the the time before you know what I mean . I really enjoy that set .

Dave 53:05

Yeah , I think that that was probably the first time that I used like the super long tails , Like I mean , I was starting to get a little braver . Um , you know , cause , as choreographers we have , we have , you know , shared things that we use that are the most commonly used things and everyone has versions of those things . But you know , we can also go in and create new things and I think like , yeah , I felt like that song deserved some experimentation .

MJ 53:46

I'm glad you experimented . Please experiment , dude , because if that's what's coming out of your experiments , you're doing a good job . Doing a great job , thanks . So actually I have a couple of artist series workouts , but I'm going to stay with Flo . This one I sort of had a feeling was coming out because we kept getting Madonna songs and other workouts and I started noticing this pattern in Supernatural . Back then it was like , oh , we're getting this song and I bet this is going to be an artist series soon . And artist series Madonna came out and I may have squealed like oh man . I recorded myself and every single one of these songs in my pajamas . I was so excited . Yes , yes .

MJ 54:35

In my pajamas I mean this whole list which songs from the Madonna were yours ? Do you remember this whole list ? Which songs from the Vendano were yours Do ?

Dave 54:44

you remember , actually , the entire workout , but I think two of them I want to say Vogue and Like a Prayer were , I think , asia Maps originally . Okay , that I updated but yeah , yeah , the entire workout I think . Yeah , that was like one of the first , I think that was the first artisers I did , you know , on my own , whatever . But , um , right , yeah , I just again , I'm not a madonna stan stan , she's a queen , don't get me wrong . But I just have a connection through my mom , who is a really huge fan and , like I mentioned before , I used to do aerobics and I felt like I needed to hop on that one .

MJ 55:46

The sentiment connection like , uh , I needed to hop on that one .

Dave 55:48

um , you know , uh , the sentiment basically to your mom yes , yes , and it's kind of like in her honor because , uh , she passed when I was younger and I feel like , uh , even though she doesn't wasn't here when , like vr fitness was around , I can just tell that she would . She would freaking love it , you know , and I tried to like channel her , vibe her , like you know , electricity , and just like put that into the workout , um , and you know , it definitely was like a cathartic release , um , you know , I don't necessarily like um , yeah , I don't talk about that that much , but I do think that . But maybe that helps , like you know , with the whole process .

MJ 56:47

I think , so yeah . I think the connection that you have and the memories that you have of your mother and being an aerobic centric , I'm sure back then you know Madonna was huge back then . That's for me . I'm not a Madonna stan either . Madonna was huge back then For me . I'm not a Madonna stan either , but when I was growing up it was massive for me when I was a kid growing up in the 80s .

MJ 57:09

So I could see why you would want to pick that to honor your mom and just the whole experience listening to the music and mapping it for movement , probably seeing your mom in your brain going oh , she would have moved like this to this song . So let's add that I think that's really cool that you were able to , to have that experience for yourself , but also to give it to the world . So we , when we play that workout , we're sort of honoring your mom .

Dave 57:41

That's how I feel . Yeah , let's say , you know , and there's like there's nothing better than that , because you can't . You can't change the past and you know you're living in the now and you want the now to shape your future . So I think like , yeah , if that's how that energy is put into the world and helps other people , then I'm all for it . Yeah , I know there's a lot of people out there who , you know , have lost friends and family members , and I know that people post about it all the time in the community . And the fact that you know that I can technically help other people going through similar things , it's all a full circle and makes me feel whole . Yeah , yeah .

MJ 58:35

That's amazing Because Supernatural really . I know we touched on it earlier , but the combination of being in VR , moving , hearing the coaches , hearing the music it is just a very cathartic experience for everyone . And then you have music that you grew up with or you know . Music , just like smell , brings memories and feelings up , and to experience that while moving in VR in these gorgeous environments is unlike anything I ever thought possible . Honestly , you know .

Dave 59:15

Yeah , just a few short years ago .

Dave 59:18

It's like you know , it's definitely yeah , it's hard to . It's hard to really imagine a time before that , even though it wasn't that long ago , Like you know , like five years ago I mean , I knew I technically had a VR headset . I had like a Galaxy here that you put your phone in or whatever and you can do a few games or whatever . But it was only four and a half years ago that I got a first quest and I really didn't know that this stuff existed because it kind of didn't . And now we're here at a really awesome place and I think that there's a lot of people discovering that , this amazing blend of music and movement and immersion for the first time , and I'm all for it .

MJ 1:00:20

Yeah , yeah , I'm into it Boxing . Yeah , yeah , I'm into it boxing . I want to talk about your boxing because this week , this week , you had a pros only boxing come out and I believe it is the first pros only boxing you've met .

Dave 1:00:43

That is a hundred percent correct . Um , yeah , I , I , I do feel like I uh I think like medium flow and high box is kind of like if I were to pick an intensity and modality in each . Those are the ones that I feel like are my , like my , cues on , you know right , yeah , um , but I think that I tend to kind of be on the minus side often because I like to , with boxing like I don't have more defense and not be so like flurry , heavy and stuff like that .

Dave 1:01:22

So I was a little like what's the word Intimidated by pros , because we've had a lot of them come out and it can be very polarizing and I don't think that that was what was actually preventing me from doing it . It was just like I think I had to , you know , just to get a little more confidence . And then , yeah , that came out and I'm very interested to see how that is received because I know it's still on probably the minus side for pros , but not necessarily a high either .

MJ 1:02:03

Right , I would agree with that assessment and the fact that it is called one foot in the rave . It's just so fitting for you , this being , uh , your

Rhythmic Targeted Boxing Workouts

MJ 1:02:18

first pros . Only , I thought it was fun . Um , you had a lot of multi-lane work going on and I'm a huge fan of multi-lane work . I thought you did that very well . Um , a lot of defensive movement , a lot of uh slip holds that I enjoyed . Um , the combinations engaged my brain there . It was trickery , but it wasn't like flurry flurry , flurry , flurry , flurry . You know it didn't . Yes , it didn't hurt to try and hit the targets . I don't know how else to say it .

MJ 1:02:56

Sometimes flurries they don't allow you to set back up properly , you know 100% .

Dave 1:03:03

This was good this was good , this was good , I think in my mind I have , you know , an analytical approach to most um most stuff . You know I do at work , like you know where I . There's a little bit of balance and symmetry and obviously it's not going to be a hundred percent symmetric , you know , depending on like dance changes and the length of the song and all those factors .

Dave 1:03:30

But I do feel like I make a considerable effort to create as much symmetry as possible without it making it feel like repetitive or boring and like you know um , I think in this one in particular , uh , I started to experiment with like minor like level changes , which is not something that I normally was doing in boxing , because I feel like , uh , if you do it too much , and what I mean by level change , obviously I think you know what I'm talking about .

Dave 1:04:08

But for people who don't like , it's just placing you know , boxing targets like at slightly lower hired kind of levels than they normally would be like . You know , know , I've been using ducks under duck hold we call them duck holds , like you know or a duck holds uh , uh , like lower duck , or a duck hook , where you put like a hook underneath the duck . You know , um , I've been using that . But aside from that , I basically put the targets where they typically are , um , and in this one I was trying to kind of lead you into these things . So if there was a series of straight punches and then at the end of that series was , um , you know , a duck hook , there would be a little bit of descending . You know , uh , I'm not sure if that was really like visible or noticeable , but it was very minor and I still felt like I did the job you know , um , and yeah , I think like uh , it definitely ramped up from the start to finish um .

Dave 1:05:21

so I definitely want to do more in the future and I'd like to do a lot of different other genres too . Yeah , Besides just EDM yeah don't get me wrong , it was great .

MJ 1:05:36

Yeah , exactly , and it was the first time Supernatural's gotten a Paul Oakenfold song too . I was so surprised by that .

Dave 1:05:43

I was like oh cool .

MJ 1:05:43

Look at us , we're a Paul Oakenfold song too . I was so surprised by that . I was like oh cool , look at us , we're getting Paul Oakenfold in here oh yeah , yeah , I could see you doing like a punk style high boxing or pros boxing maybe .

Dave 1:06:00

Definitely that would be fun . Maybe , um , definitely be fun . Um , yeah , I think that , uh , there was another workout that , now that you brought that up . That um , punk you um , oh yeah high boxing . It's called need for speed yes so , yes so that obviously was my subtitle . That was my suggestion .

MJ 1:06:25

Was it .

Dave 1:06:26

Yeah , yeah , I mean , yeah , I think that obviously , if you don't know , I like puns and kind of dad joke puns , things that are probably not that funny , but it's kind of like aha , bad joke puns , things that are probably not that funny , but it's kind of like aha , anyway . So , because these are all like high tempo punk songs and there's knee strikes that just immediately . Oh , and there's a song , the Damned Neat , neat , neat .

Dave 1:06:58

I don't want to say it three times fast . So I don't know . There's just something about um that that just spoke to me and I think it was the first . Yeah , punk you with new stripes and it's high boxing and I feel like the um density of the targets was a little higher than the standard high boxing , uh , but I thought it was like a fun raucous like 13 minutes or something Like it was pretty short for a full workout because the songs are short . But I think that's my top five most fun I've had mapping a workout , I think .

MJ 1:07:39

Oh well , that's good to know . So you said medium flow is your sweet spot and high boxing is your sweet spot . Typically , yeah , there was a girl power with Tawana , unbreakable spirit , and that's a 16 minute one and it has classic supernatural songs in it like bulletproof titanium . It's also got another Florence , the machine song in spectrum .

Dave 1:08:16

Yes , yes .

MJ 1:08:17

Do you remember mapping that one Cause that one's sort of a high plus ish If I'm honest , honest funny .

Dave 1:08:25

funny because I I will have to double verify this , but I am 99.9 sure that that was the first high box I did . I think before that I had done some , maybe at a medium , some low , whatever that was the first , I'm pretty sure , first high boxing I did , and I did it kind of recently and although we've added a lot of new types of movements , I still think that it's still a lot of fun . You know , and empowering , and you know I and empowering , and you know , uh , I love the music and the message . And you know , yeah , I think , uh , it's not like reinventing the wheel , but it just hits all the places that it needs to , at least for me . So right .

MJ 1:09:21

So when you get a workout I know the way you know the curators come up with the set list then they kind of have an idea of the category . So girl power , for example , and you get that and you look at it . Are you like basing the movements on like powerful moves , like you want to ? You said you like to tell a story , so is that part of your process ? You know you get it from the curators and you're like , okay , so this is girl power , this is just dance , let's make sure they feel like fish in here .

Dave 1:09:55

Or , you know , make sure they're super powerful is that kind of the way you do that yeah , yeah , I mean , it does vary , obviously , from like flow to boxing , I think , with flow , depending on what you know the music is and if there's like music videos and stuff like that , like .

Dave 1:10:19

I think a lot of us like to check out music videos or like , even like , if there are like kind of like homebrew choreographer choreo videos on youtube sometimes check that stuff out um other times I'll go in line to not not . You know , it really depends um with boxing . I feel like there's still some inspiration to be taken from that stuff , but it's not as like easy like , because unless there's like a fight going on which is kind of rare , but yeah , I think that I don't go from start to finish really ever .

Dave 1:11:10

I kind of go wherever I go , yeah , and I think in some ways , going from like A to B to C to D or 1 to whatever I think can kind of . It's not artificial , but it's like almost like forced , like you know that you're pushing it a little higher and like you could kind of feel it . And while that's good , I think sometimes like there's like more mystery , mystique , I around just kind of having things not necessarily feel like like they were literally done one after another . Um , so , yeah , if I can , I will usually hop into like the first song and then maybe like hop into like the first song and then maybe , like you know , it just depends on you know what I'm doing , but , um , I feel like I almost never do like from start to finish Right .

MJ 1:12:13

Got it .

Dave 1:12:13

Yeah .

MJ 1:12:14

I think that would be my way as well . It's like which song do I want to ? I'll just pick a song . I won't start with the actual set list . That is probably the way I would do it too .

Dave 1:12:25

Yeah , and it depends also , like you know , if they're like something like the drop , if a lot of the songs are like the same tempo or something like there could be patterns , that that you build like for boxing , like certain combos , like you know , jab , know , jab , cross , hook , uppercut , slip , and then you take that combo and you can probably use that combo in most of the songs in different ways and then sometimes , like , if you leave notes for whoever's coaching it , you know they'll talk about it in the warm-up .

Dave 1:13:04

That way you're ready for it like right . So in a way it kind of does help , at least for me to not try to , um , yeah , go from a to b , so like everything in life .

MJ 1:13:19

So exactly , it's just I , I'm not an A to B person . Then to see , I'm like all over , let's just go everywhere , yeah .

MJ 1:13:29

You mentioned that the Madonna Artist Series Flow was your first like full Artist Series workout , that you were responsible . Yeah Well , you know . A month later the Queen RS series came out , and I know in y'all's world it's not like you work on this , then that , and then this , and then that . It comes out in all sorts of different times , but it came out to us , to the community , a month later . Medium boxing Queen . Are you responsible for the whole workout too , or do you work with multiple people ? Oh , cool .

Dave 1:14:09

Oh , that one , that one I think was like I would say , all the maps in that workout are definitely mine uh but I don't .

Dave 1:14:20

I don't know if there were ones that existed in some way before , because we've had Queen , but there were times that we , you know I think , lost some songs and then they came back or whatever . And also , I feel like it was like when boxing was introduced , there wasn't a ton . I don't know , I really don't know , but I'm pretty sure that those were all original maps , if not four out of five , and yeah , that was so much fun as well . Another kind of like you know , music that my parents listened to and it's like another nod to them as well . But yeah , I think parents listen to and it's like another nod to them as well . Um , but uh , yeah , I think .

Dave 1:15:07

Uh , while I loved every single map , um , I would say bicycle race and probably , um , somebody to love you know yeah are my two favorites , just because they're like polar opposites yes my school race was chaos and insanity and like what I feel like is going on my brain all the time , and then somebody to love is like the opposite of that . So um uh yeah , that gave me .

MJ 1:15:38

I'm talking about um and , I think , first time I used the , the disco rainbow pride uh joy ball . Oh , you said joy ball . I stopped myself , I don't know if you called that I did , I almost .

Dave 1:15:55

I almost said the other thing , yeah , that thing .

MJ 1:15:58

We don't say that one on this podcast . Hmm , yeah , somebody to love First . First of all , that is a five minute song when you get songs like that that are like four plus minutes long , are you like whoa , what am I gonna do here ? What am I gonna do for this entire song ? Does it freak you out , that one ?

Dave 1:16:19

that one not so much , because it sounds like a couple different songs .

MJ 1:16:25

Yeah .

Dave 1:16:27

With a lot of Queen . It's kind of like A or B , we Will Rock . You is kind of like Stomp , Stomp Clap . That is the song basically . But then you have things like Lean In Rhapsody and Somebody to Love that are like kind of like multiple short songs sandwiched together , woven , you know , like kind of yeah , and I think with that song in particular , yeah , I think if it's something that's like repetitive in five minutes , I feel like I would have a little bit more almost disdain for it . Um , because I want to keep it original and fun . Um , but yeah , that one was super great that's changing and in multiple songs .

MJ 1:17:21

In one song is probably the best to map , I would imagine . Yes , you can use your creativity and do so many different things in it .

Dave 1:17:31

Yep I know that , like with the flow workout , um , I know there is that was like one of the first , I think I really collaborative maps . I didn't work on the bo Bohemian Rhapsody when that first came out , but I know there was four choreographers on that one and I mean it deserved it . I mean it's a long song with a lot of parts , you know , and yeah , and then the only other that I can off the top of my head , free Bird's , the only other song that had that many choreographers on that and that I did work on . But that's a totally different workout .

MJ 1:18:15

It is . But this gave me a really cool idea and I'm going to put it out in the universe we need more longer songs so that we can get you guys working together on one song , Because if we only have Bohemian Rhapsody and Freebird as like a legit multi-choreographer mapped song , we need longer songs Nine minutes . You know some tool , some tool we can we get some tool please ?

Dave 1:18:49

oh man , I mean me and justin are already um trying to . Yeah , um , I that it would be great , um , I think that the there are some logistical things , like because obviously , obviously there aren't as many um , first off , you know , and then out of that , like there are some that may endure for a while and aren't necessarily like if the fog is that long .

Dave 1:19:16

There usually is at least a few points that are very low Too slow , yeah , exactly so , unlike Freebird , where it ramps and then never goes down . So I think that I agree and I feel like it would be great to have , like you know I think this has been mentioned before but like a whole , like DJ set or something like you know , where there's no real gaps , like I'll do it , I'll do the dj set , no , um , but uh , yeah , that would be great because , like I think people are always asking for ways to chain things together and make longer workouts . So , um , you know , I think that would be a cool way to collaborate and also get smaller pieces of content out there .

MJ 1:20:06

Yeah , that would be kind of neat . And then , with that kind of music as it's ebbing and flowing while there would be no true break , um , it would be a really good hit workout . For sure I could see that .

Dave 1:20:20

Yeah , a hundred percent . Um , yeah , it would be great . Um , I think , uh , we had some things that kind of like are in that vein , but they always have the traditional , you know , a couple of seconds interstitial between the two . Um , so , yeah , the two .

MJ 1:20:43

So yeah , hmm ,

Favorite Moves and Emotional Connections

MJ 1:20:48

That'd be neat . So do you have a favorite move that you like to use often in your maps ? Flo . Let's go with Flo first .

Dave 1:20:55

So I think it's hard to say . I feel like I don't use it as much as some other people , but um a lot of like single arm , kind of flowy movements , like we have um something that we refer to as a , a duster tail , which is very , very commonly used . It's just kind of like kind of a back and forth .

Dave 1:21:31

you know , Um , and I think , like uh , it's a kind of like kind of a back and forth . You know , um , and I think , like uh , it's a very simple move , but it can be used in conjunction with you know other things and sometimes like you know you can be getting to .

Dave 1:21:44

I think , like cosmic love is a good example of where I was using that . And then the other I'm doing kind of like , you know , interdependent things . So I like , I like that , um , you know , I like having you know getting to separate things but that are still , uh , readable and fun and doable . And yeah , I like that using windmills , those are super fun , not overusing them , but just the little hints of windmills in there . And then I would say , if I do some multi-lane work , I like just what I call like that range of motion or whatever moves where , especially into squats , for some reason , I don't know why it feels good .

Dave 1:22:43

But you know , even if it's just like two outward facing tails into , that's like kind of I don't know if that's a me signature thing , but when I do multi-win I do that a lot where it's like two tails into , you know , left and right , um , downward hits into a spot , and that for me , even though it you could technically do the same exact movement , um , because the targets come to you , I think the visual cue is telling you let's do a little bit more , let's put a little more into it . You know , and I think , yeah , that's the same with all the multi-length stuff , because if you have like forward facing , only on , you're not going to see it , but if you don't like , I think it just promotes that extra right , I agree .

MJ 1:23:34

Yes , it encourages you to be bigger , to be flowier , and then the power of going out and then down into a squat . Love that , love that .

Dave 1:23:44

That's yes , that's a power hit .

MJ 1:23:46

You know that makes you want to be powerful . It makes you feel powerful . Um , you spoke about windmills and it reminds me of a song . It's one of my it's in one of my absolute favorite workouts . You have the two last songs in it . It's joy , go do it with Mark . It's from February of 2023 . I remember the day that came out , I played it three times back to back . I recorded . I sent two friends separate messages . I said record the end . You record , go do , send it to me . Let's do this . You know , like right away , immediately , and you have the end end , which featured this complex two I don't even know how to explain it the windmills . It was so new at the time , no one had ever done that in that way , um , and it was so fun . It's like the longest windmill section , um inflow and it was really fun .

Dave 1:24:52

Um , it's a great workout . Yeah , I , that , actually . I . I actually was not familiar with that song in particular , even though I've heard mr lives before . Um , and for some reason , the first thing that comes up is mark's joke about the end not being the end , like you know . Um , that's obviously right at the top and I'm like , yeah , so anyway , um , besides the end not being the end , uh , yeah , I think , like the last , like . I don't know . Half of that song is windfalls it is , it is it's , but not overwhelming .

Dave 1:25:30

It's still a comfy , maybe even kind of bounces between a high minus and high plus in some areas . And yeah , I just felt like that's another one where it's like the music totally dictates Not that it doesn't ever I mean it always dictates what you're going to do . But that one really stood out . It was like okay , I'm going to . You know . I didn't even need to question what I was doing there when it happened , you know .

MJ 1:26:02

You knew immediately . And so the back half of that song when the windmills happen , they happen twice and it's for a long amount of time . But then towards the back half you start spinning us and spinning us and I absolutely love that part . And then we come back into the windmills in the original portal and it's like three portals . Oh man , it's fantastic . That is a really fun song map . It gives me all the feels . But yes , the next one go do by Jonesy . That is a magical song , then a magical map in a magical location . It's like the trifecta of things . Yes , tell us about GoDo .

Dave 1:26:54

Okay , this has a good story , because I have kind of for as long as I can remember , probably since high school , been obsessed with Iceland , and I have you know been into a lot of Icelandic artists , bands , musicians , all that stuff , and Jónsi is the singer of Sigur Rós and they are an Icelandic band that is really huge ineland and the rest of the world , but just not necessarily like radio music , because it's kind of like a little more abstract . You know um . Anyway , this side project , that that he did um , was a little bit less abstract and a little even though there's still some kind of funky stuff in there it it sticks well , sticks well alongside indie rock , you know , and it's not as like cause his band was more like walls of sound . You know , this is like more approachable music that's fun and happy , not like , oh my God , this is so intense , what's on ? I love it , but what's going on , you know um .

Dave 1:28:13

So that song I actually got the chance to see live too , which was really amazing . Years ago they did , I think , like one . He did one tour um when he came to new york .

Dave 1:28:27

I saw it and as soon as I saw that come , that song come through um iteration I was like , yes , please , please , please , um , and not only , did you know , I mapped it , but obviously I suggested not obviously , but I suggested doing it in the blue lagoon , um , because you know , not only is he from Iceland , but that's where I spent my honeymoon and it's actually the first thing I did when we got to Iceland was went straight to the lagoon . So , yeah , it just kind of I felt super connected to that song , that location , everything about it . And I think we used the song again recently and I don't think it was in iceland , um , but but there was also a little there's some different moves in that too , just like very minor changes , um , so I'll give it a pass .

MJ 1:29:32

Well , I'm going to be honest with you . It broke a mine in Julia's brain , the new version because one . We're very connected to the location of certain maps and for us that song , that map is connected to , to Iceland , to the blue lagoon . So it was an updated map and you updated a little bit and I was like , well , what has he done to our song ? And then it was in a new environment , you know , um yeah but it's great , it's still great .

MJ 1:30:02

It did throw us off . We were like is this different ? Is this new ? Is this the same ? We can't tell . We were like going back and forth doing this workout together , but I love that for you , you have this emotional connection to the song , to the location , to the , to the band . It came out in your movements and now we , in turn , have an emotional connection to the song , to the band , to the , to the workout .

MJ 1:30:33

A hundred percent have an emotional connection to the song to the band to the , to the workout we picked go do for our huge end of the year , side-by-side last year when I told you .

MJ 1:30:42

Oh yeah , I remember that I told Julia Okay , so our last record was 110 people , this year , let's beat that . And she was like marla , so we picked go do because it was just perfect . The whole vibe of it , the idea , mark's coaching in that one is top notch and , um , yeah , we wanted the whole community , anyone who wanted to send in a video , to experience that map and that song . And , uh , you did a beautiful job on it , dude , beautiful job , one of my all time favorite top 10 .

Dave 1:31:20

Awesome , that's great . And I think , like you know , there's some music that I feel like there maybe people wouldn't necessarily think of as like workout music , but I think it's more like , um , yeah , I think it might not be something that you listen to every day or whatever , but if the movements are there and the pieces kind of fall into place , then it can become , like you know , exhilarating , even if it's something that maybe if you listen just like on a random Wednesday on Spotify or something , it would just be like maybe a skip , I wouldn't . But I'm just saying , like you know , there are definitely songs out there that feel amazing to move to , but I wouldn't listen to .

MJ 1:32:21

Right , it's um . It's a funny sort of juxtaposition . If you think about it like you wouldn't listen to it normally you wouldn't think , oh , I'll dance in this , I'll move in this . But you put it in an environment , you create a map , map , you put it all together with a coach and you're like I can't not think about moving to this song . Now you know um there's so many like that that I've discovered in supernatural um part of the magic that you guys create .

Dave 1:32:46

Yeah , it's definitely a juxtaposition , like you said , and I think , uh , I'm always amazed at what , like when I joined the community , like and I saw , like you know , people moving and really enjoying music that I would not expect them to like a lot of like dubstep and like really gritty electronic music , like you know , I mean , the centipede challenge is like right , kind of like a really great example of that . Like I mean , in reality , would 90 of the people who played that workout and really got into that song have listened to it organically ? No , I don't think so . Like they would have probably heard it and been like what the heck ? Yes , exactly .

MJ 1:34:04

So yeah , it's . It's just . You know , the right is my job . I'm a choreographer , I make maps . You know how does that evolve ? Or has it evolved from then to now what you're putting out ?

Dave 1:34:17

No , it's exactly the same . I've never changed anything .

MJ 1:34:20

Well it's maybe . I know , I know you are . You are the . I need to let people know that you are the biggest goofball . You like to troll people . You like to joke . Your dad jokes your puns . You're absolutely hilarious , but I always mess up like really quickly you do you do , you do , you can't . You're like a little kid , you're like oh , oh . I got to tell him the truth , I got to tell him the truth .

Dave 1:34:42

Just kidding , just kidding , just kidding .

MJ 1:34:45

Yeah , boy you , but yeah , I think for me as an outsider , playing your work , going through your workouts , playing some of your super old ones and then playing , say , base meditation , the new medium that you put out I see a lot more freedom .

Personal Growth and Supernatural Impact

MJ 1:35:11

I see a lot more confidence in your movement placements . Um , I see more creativity , like yeah , you're like okay . Well , let's just put this here and see what it feels like . Oh , that feels good . You know , I see progress , I see I think you getting better .

Dave 1:35:30

That makes a lot of sense and I think , uh , you know , it makes a lot of sense .

Dave 1:35:32

And I think , uh , you know , it's been over three years now , um , and I think that I'm not the whole first year but around , like , let's just say the first year was really finding the stride , you know , and kind of like , um , I feel like a lot of it was emulating what I was seeing , like in other maths , you know , and kind of like I feel like a lot of it was emulating what I was seeing , like in other maps , you know , and not really , like you know , venturing too far away from what we call our snippets , you know , what people use , like you know .

Dave 1:36:05

So it was the my map , but comprised of map , but comprised of kind of free , like um , predetermined pieces , essentially like a puzzle that you know , the pieces were already created and I put the puzzle together , whereas , like now , I feel like I'm not only creating the pieces themselves and then creating the puzzle , if that analogy makes sense it totally makes sense , I get that yeah , and it feels like , um , that also coincides with my wellness journey , uh , which started around the time you know pretty much that I started supernatural and has , you know , gotten exponentially more important to me and has grown .

Dave 1:37:06

I think that they there's definitely parallels , like you know , uh , between moving movement and between meditation and between , uh , just caring about what I eat and like not like going out , partying and stuff like that , like all those things kind of go hand in hand and come together to , I feel like , inspire and help me put out better things and think more clearly and be more creative yeah .

MJ 1:37:44

Yeah , I totally . I can totally see that , and you know one of my . I was going to ask you , I can totally see that , and you know one of my . I was going to ask you how has supernatural impacted your life ? And I think you just answered that without being prompted to answer that . You know um just the whole journey of bettering yourself and in the end , it allows you to be more creative , put out better work , um give to the world better , um yes , and it's beautiful full full circle .

Dave 1:38:22

You know , uh , you know , obviously I mentioned this , but I just there are so many people out there who were , were where I was , you know , like , uh , where I just couldn't really find something that I liked and I kind of just thought that that was going to be this . You know , the status quo going forward that I wouldn't , you know , ever really , uh , I wasn't like really too upset about it , which is something that I accepted .

Dave 1:38:50

You know , um , that I probably wouldn't be like a gym person or I wouldn't be fit or whatever , um , but you know , not even just from a physical standpoint , but from an emotional standpoint too . You know it's like everyone goes through things , whether it's grief , or you know health related things , or you know even like financial things . You know , just everybody is always going through something and you can't really compare people's problems . But the one thing that I feel like is consistent is that there is always something you can do about it , and if that something is supernatural and it's helping people , it just like you know .

MJ 1:39:40

That just motivates me even more , you know yeah , it's the positive feedback loop , you know um 100 I definitely see that .

MJ 1:39:50

And supernatural I know you know , but supernatural has helped me in my own life , regulate my emotions , help me feel better about myself , all around health , like it's really changed my entire life . Sometimes I go as dramatic as it has saved my life more times than than I can count . And what you guys do every day makes a huge impact . Makes a huge impact in so many of us and I hope you can take that in and and know that we really mean it genuinely when we say that . You know they do .

Dave 1:40:36

Yeah , I do absorb that . I know that . The others do . You know , there's definitely some like small , like subconscious , like imposter syndrome , that kind of creeps up sometimes , just you know . But , um , there's a really easy way to you know combat that is just to look at the community and just like , just read things and your feedback , or just play a workout not even one of my own just like like I'm a part of this and even if I didn't like , even if I didn't have this job , I think that I would have significantly benefited from supernatural , because I've had over a year of being an athlete and I totally like it was obviously setting me on the right path you know , so , yeah , I think things would be very different without it , and I do think that everything happens for a reason , which actually kind of brings me to something that I was going to mention really early on , something that I was going to mention really early on , but I I don't know if you've ever been curious about what my Instagram handle was .

Dave 1:42:07

Yes , I just didn't want to pry and be like hey , dave , what is this about ? Yeah , okay , so it's kind of like , uh , I don't know if I'd call it a pun , um , but so my last name is pronounced well , we pronounce it cassara .

Accepting Fate and Embracing Change

Dave 1:42:23

Um , you know , uh , and the phrase Que sera sera , which is not actually Spanish or Italian or French , it's kind of just like it's a song from the 50s , I think it was like Doris Day , and it's supposed to mean whatever will be will be . That was like my family mantra growing up . You know it's like whatever will happen , will happen and , like you know , you have to make the best of it and move up . You know it's like whatever will happen will happen and , like you know , you have to make . You know , make the best of it and move forward . And so , hey , sarah was my dj name , my alias , like all that kind of stuff , and so that's why that's actually my um instagram handle , but I do feel , like um , it has become my mantra , for sure .

Dave 1:43:17

Um , and you know , I think that there's so many things that I didn't do . I wouldn't be here right now , um , and I'm so grateful for that . Like yeah , yeah , I got a targeted ad for Supernatural on Facebook which came full circle , and you know , if I didn't see that ad , you know , then I might not be here If I didn't interact with something that triggered that ad in the first place . I know , yeah , there's just so many like cold , I guess , butterfly effect , if you will situations that really really just lead up to today and tomorrow . So that was just a little tidbit .

MJ 1:44:11

Yeah . So basically your mantra and the whole way you live your life is let it be what it's going to be , embrace it .

Dave 1:44:20

Yeah , I like everything . You know it's very cliche , but everything happens for a reason and you know just it was . It's not a novel idea to live in the now , but what I like to say is to live in the now , learn from the past and work towards the future . Um , because all three of them exist , you know . They've been just in different states of time and I think that you have to kind of accept all three past , present , future to have the best now .

MJ 1:45:05

You're absolutely right about that . You're absolutely right about that . When you put it in that way , I have a trouble staying in the now . I'm a future person and occasionally I get stuck in the past and so bringing it forward to now , here in this moment , this present moment , what we're doing , um , everything we've it's led up to this moment . Everything we've it's led up to this moment . You know , and I'm a big believer in that , so I totally relate with that . And now I know where your Instagram handle came from , and instead of being like what is this dude on ?

Dave 1:45:42

And how to pronounce my name and how to pronounce your name .

MJ 1:45:45

Cause I did not say your last name at the beginning , that's fine . It's fine , it makes total sense .

Dave 1:45:52

Yes , yes , and it's actually a good . It's good that I didn't start with that , honestly , because , like um , it's a nice little tidbit . It is now um , and yeah , it it's just just like a play on my last name and the mantra all in one , and very Dave .

MJ 1:46:15

It's very Dave .

Dave 1:46:16

Exactly , it was either that or dance , dance Davey again , which would also be right .

MJ 1:46:21

But I'm re . I know that's an old school nickname for you , but I'm going to change it up today and it's going to be dance , dance , ravey , sorry , not sorry , that's fine .

Dave 1:46:30

I'm full with that , that's fine 2.0 .

MJ 1:46:34

Version 2.0 . 6.7 .

Dave 1:46:38

I don't know , I feel like we've all gone through way too many . Way more metamorphosis yeah .

MJ 1:46:46

It's a good way to put it . Yeah , good way to put it Joy balls .

Dave 1:46:50

For sure .

MJ 1:46:52

I yeah good way to put it joy balls . For sure I'm gonna bring up joy balls again because they are my favorite . Do you have a favorite one you like to use ?

Dave 1:46:59

uh , this probably won't come as a surprise , um , just because of , like , my existence , but , um , I like what we internally call plexus . Uh , but I'm not sure where the name exactly came from , but it's the geometric , almost constellation-looking one that I used in Cosmic Blow , maybe one of the first times I used it . I think that , yeah , I don't know it , just it's kind of like it's one ball that you know is connected by a bunch of lines and kind of grows like almost like an organism , and then it's gone and I don't know . It's just , it's pretty , but it also , I feel like , says something . So it's pretty , but it also , I feel like it says something .

MJ 1:47:53

It's meaningful to you ? Yeah , and that's .

Dave 1:47:56

I like geometry .

MJ 1:47:57

Yeah and well , and that's seriously the the theme of this episode for me me , you know , having you here and talking to you , it's something that's woven in through all of this . Is you like ? You know you're all about connecting meaningful moments , the now .

Dave 1:48:18

It totally does not surprise me that that's your favorite joy ball and I'm sure you would like use it all the time if you could yes , and I would like an actual , like constellation type , you know like legitimate . I would love if it would be , like you know , ursa Minor , you know like actual constellations . Yes , yes , that's my other alias , by the way .

MJ 1:48:49

Oh really . Oh well , now we know all your aliases yes , yes , yes , yes , um yeah well now I'm really interested to hear your answer to this next question . I've been asking all the choreographers and I thought about taking this question off because I I feel like a lot of you guys answer in the same way .

MJ 1:49:11

I won't be honest but , I'm going to leave it here because I'm interested to know your answer . And if you could like , just poof and do a different job in supernatural trade jobs with someone , you don't have to be good at it , you'd just be going to just do their job because you're interested in it . What job would you ? What job would you pick ?

Dave 1:49:35

So I feel like I probably should have thought about this more , but something does stand out and I think we have . These are probably a couple of different positions , but I believe they're referred to as technical artists or like a creative lead designer . Basically , they work on things like environments and Easter eggs . You know I'm talking about , no , uh , anyway , environments , joy balls , you know effects , like you know , tails and all these different types of things and , uh , you know , I have obviously experience with design and even more recently with VR , like you know , using Unity , and uh , I just , yeah , something about it , you know , fascinates me and .

Dave 1:50:35

I feel like if I could have like a hybrid job where I did a little bit of that and a little bit of this , that'd be cool .

MJ 1:50:42

That would be really cool and I'm so glad you picked the visual aspect of it , the environments or the joy balls or the tails , and that would be really cool . And I would love to chat with someone from who makes the environments , the 3d environments we're all in Cause . I know it's a multi-step approach . They take pictures , they build things . It's like a whole design . I mean , how cool and involved in the detail , the detail in those environments .

Dave 1:51:16

That's the icing on the cake . You know , it is the icing on the cake .

MJ 1:51:20

Definitely , speaking of cake , julia will kill me if I do not ask you this question . She will come find us and hunt us down .

Workout Recommendation

MJ 1:51:37

Favorite food I believe you favorite food favorite snack .

Dave 1:51:39

You could give me your favorite snack too , either one . Well , I , I'm like a really really , really , really really big sweet person . Oh , I don't want to pick that as my favorite food , because I feel like if you lived on , let's say , like cookies or something like they probably wouldn't really live very long now . Um , so , food , food , um , you know , my boring answer would be pizza . That would be my boring answer , okay , but I can make it a little bit more spicy by saying Indian , like chicken korma chicken masala , stuff like that , and even more spicy by saying not New York pizza .

Dave 1:52:25

If I'm talking about pizza and not Chicago , there's actually a little lesser known pizza . It's New Haven style , so Connecticut , and it's actually my favorite pizza Bar none . I used to drive like hours to pick up a couple pies . Check it out if you're ever in Connecticut .

MJ 1:52:47

I'm gonna have to now because I've . I don't think I've ever heard about this Connecticut pie .

Dave 1:52:51

Yeah , yeah , and they have some of them in New York now too .

MJ 1:52:58

But I mean , I guess like I'm a bad New Yorker for saying that I was going to say you said not New York pizza . And I'm thinking all of New York homies are about to come for you because they're like what , Really ?

Dave 1:53:07

Don't hurt me .

MJ 1:53:10

That's awesome , I could get down with that . So you're bringing the pizza in the Indian food to our potluck . Then Got it .

Dave 1:53:17

Or even together .

MJ 1:53:19

Oh , some chicken parma pizza that sounds fire Right . Is this a thing , or are you making this up , because I feel like you need to make it .

Dave 1:53:27

I'm sure it is . I've had it on flatbread .

MJ 1:53:34

I've had it on flatbread .

Dave 1:53:35

Yeah , I've had it on a flatbread actually , um so with non . So , yeah , yeah , so it's just together there you go um , let's do it . I had chicken karma for dinner last night actually really so that's awesome it's perfect that you said that okay it's actually not spicy at all , that's like it's not so mild , so mild , so mild .

MJ 1:53:51

Yeah , in Indian food dishes it's super mild . Yes , yeah , it's got like little raisins in it too . Oh man , now I know what I'm eating for lunch . Dave's got me all sidetracked on the food now . No , it's Julia's fault . This is Julia's question . Blaming her ? I Blame it on her . I should have said her cookies . No , you should . We definitely need to .

Dave 1:54:28

So , as you know , I'm sure , because I know you watch the podcast , I always ask people if they were going to pick an emoji animal to use as a hug reaction . What would you pick ? Okay , what would you pick ? Okay , I'm gonna turn it and say what would you think I did ? Oh gosh , um , I will give you the answer and tell you if you're right , but what do you think I would pick ?

MJ 1:54:45

I feel like I need to pull up my keyboard real quick . Um , and look . Okay , here we go , we go . I think it is cheating . I asked this question and don't even know all the animals . I'll be honest when I picked my emoji animal , I stopped looking at him . Okay , I want to say the blue dinosaur , for some reason . No , what is it ? It's okay A panda , a panda , oh , why would you pick a panda ?

Dave 1:55:24

And the story is basically that that's my wife and I think name is Bear Instead of Babe we say Bear some people do that , you know , uh , but our first halloween , uh , we dressed up as a panda and a koala , and that kind of always stuck with me . I love bears in general , but out of the emoji ones , that's the one I like the most . But I also have this bear , um , and I have a bunch of other bears scattered throughout my office , um , but yeah , the panda , it's just , you know the .

MJ 1:56:03

I like the contrast , I like the pandas in general , um , but yeah , panda , panda , panda I love that , and if I would have been just a little bit more observant I might have gotten that correct .

Dave 1:56:17

You put me on the spot today that's , that's what I do . They don't have puffins , though . I would pick puffins , that's what I was looking for .

MJ 1:56:29

I was like , is there a puffin ? Because I know he , you know , makes sense Iceland puffin out . You're sentimental . So I was trying to connect it in my head real quick . I was like , but there's no puffer in here . Man , good detective work . Yeah , I try , I try , I try . So every week we leave the audience with a workout suggestion . Would be awesome if you picked out that suggestion this week um .

Dave 1:56:56

So there's a lot , but I feel like one of the ones top three most like meaning for me would probably be it wasn't the first indestructible , but it was like one of the first when that came back . The medium flow with Mark flow meets body , because start to finish , it's just like they're not bangers but they're bangers , you know . You know it runs the gambit of like that whole indie spirit . You know it sounds kind of like a soundtrack for a movie , which I think a lot of those songs were . But anyway , um , flow meets body .

Dave 1:57:45

Um , that was a lot of new stuff for me and again one of the ones that I , one of the persons I did , I think like completely Um , so that was um . Yeah , that's my recommendation .

MJ 1:58:08

I love that you picked this one because the set starts with a postal service song and , like I , was huge into postal service , like back in the day , and I know , such great heights and older workouts was one of your maps , and so you got to kind of redo it for this one , which I thought was really rad , um , and so we get an updated version for um , such great heights .

Dave 1:58:32

And I've actually done that in low , medium and high . It's like your song , one of the only ones that I've done that in low , medium and high . So yeah , just be on lookout for those .

MJ 1:58:50

The second song , I Feel it All has this move in it where it feels like you're giving yourself a hug . That , yes , that is what is it ? Is it really because ? Oh , that is what I call a real easter egg , that's and then your wings are wide .

Dave 1:59:07

So there's , yeah , definitely intentional there that's . I didn't even mention that , but , like you know , I definitely try the lyrical stuff like I really um love to do like kind of hugging , kind of motions , when there's like you know , like a sweet disposition . I've got too .

MJ 1:59:26

Yes , I was just getting to that kind of hugging , kind of a hugging motion . I cannot , I love .

Dave 1:59:32

That's hard Heart tells .

MJ 1:59:34

Yeah , yes , them Matt , your sweet disposition man . You . I'm so happy today that this worked . This is another workout that it came out . It dropped and I played back to back to back . Like I played it , got out of the headset , sent messages everyone play this workout . And like I recorded sweet disposition on my first playthrough , I just knew , I just knew I had to capture it . And then sent messages OK , record this record that we're recording this whole set , everyone . So I love that this is your workout suggestion .

Dave 2:00:13

Awesome , yeah , I mean I , this is your workout suggestion . Awesome , um , yeah , I mean I probably should play it again too . Uh , it's been a while , but yeah , when your episode comes out .

MJ 2:00:29

Yes , for sure . Which is now .

Dave 2:00:29

It is for the people , for the audience is now .

MJ 2:00:30

So make sure you now . So make sure you check Dave's journey , make sure he played this workout with us since he suggested it . You know , yes , yes , yes , yes . And when people are done with the workout or any workouts they do very importante Look to the left and rate it Like love , give all the reasons you liked or loved it . You can even hit other and it will generate a email and then you can send detailed feedback , like this song . They made me hug myself when they said feel Like , put that in the email . You know that would be fantastic .

Dave 2:01:15

They want to hear . We see it . Yeah , yeah , we see that stuff .

MJ 2:01:18

So you guys talk about it yeah rating it is uh how they know to give us more like that , or yeah , no , we're not into that today .

Dave 2:01:29

Yeah , it's the easiest , most surefire way to get your opinion heard , and yeah , do it Awesome .

MJ 2:01:41

Well , I just want to say thank you , Dave , for coming on and hanging out with me today and letting the community meet you Now . You guys all know , of course . Mr Rave , that's what I call him . No , his name is Dave , that's fine .

Dave 2:01:56

Well , it's been a pleasure and , yeah , I just super excited about the future , you know the future is bright , very bright .

MJ 2:02:08

For sure , all right see you guys next time . Bye , thanks for joining us on today's episode of for the love of the map . As always , you can join the discussion in the private facebook group and follow along with show updates on instagram and tiktok . Links can be found in the description below . If you find value in the show , please share it with your friends . Your comments , likes and reviews are invaluable and I cannot thank you guys enough . See you next time .